John
Dec 29, 05 - 2:50 AM |
4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD POLAND
I'm thinking about relocating to Poland and was hoping I could
continue with my hobby of owning and driving 4x4 cars offroad. Can
anyone tell me anything about 4x4 Offroading in Poland? What 4wd
cars are available used. Do many people own SUVs? What kind of
offroad tracks (forests, etc) can you find in Poland. Are there
any 4x4 clubs in Poland? Couldn't find anything much on the net.
Location: Raleigh, NC
|
dajwid
Dec 29th, 2005 - 10:58 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Off roading is big in Poland, nost people tend to use GAS or Uaz
cars as they are cheap and really basic 'both are russianor Polish
I think'. Small suzukis are the next choice they are cheap and
pretty tough. Then the rich guys stick to anything Japanese, Nisan
being very popular. I found the off road comunity to be rather
close knit not like in the UK open to everyone. There are hundreds
of clubs but to search you will need polish. I can search for a
few links I will get back to you.
As for tracks they are everwhere!!!
|
Norman
Dec 29th, 2005 - 11:08 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Are you allowed to drive cars through the forest in Poland? When I
was there last I saw lots of great dirt tracks but my Polish guide
said for non forestry cars it was forbidden to use them.
Location: Cambridge
|
John
Dec 29th, 2005 - 10:31 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Thanks for information, Dajwid. It'd be great to get more 
.
What are the most popular offroad cars in Poland? Are there many
real offroaders like Jeep or Land Rover on the roads?
Location: Raleigh, NC
|
Cliff
Dec 30th, 2005 - 12:58 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Can people afford luxury cars like Land Rovers and Jeeps in Poland
and the gas needed to keep them running 
Location: USA
|
varsovian
Dec 30th, 2005 - 12:00 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Cliff,
Some people in Poland are actually rich ...
A well-off friend of mine had American relations over for the
first time in 40 years and they were shocked at coming to an
affluent suburb of Warsaw. Of course, there is also great poverty
here too - just like you've got your trailer parks and your black
refugees in the US.
|
Simon
Dec 30th, 2005 - 12:07 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Well said, varsovian! I was just going to say pretty much the same
thing
. It's true that the majority of Poles may not be too well off by
western standards, but there are still plenty of Poles rich enough
to afford an expensive SUV / 4WD car; a nice detached house;
vacations abroad and a luxurious lifestyle. Come to Poland and see
for yourself.
|
Simon
Dec 30th, 2005 - 12:24 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
On the subject of 4WD/4x4 cars, have a look at this article about
a new Chinese made SUV
!!!
Chinese
4x4 gets zero in safety test
|
varsovian
Dec 30th, 2005 - 1:53 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
BTW Si, did you know that 10 days is the usual holiday entitlement
given in the States and average income is $31 000.
As a result, Americans don't have an annual summer holiday with
the kids. Generally, they spread their holidays out across the
year in a series of long weekends spent watching TV and nursing
hangovers.
Instead of a life, they have work and gadgets.
|
dajwid
Dec 30th, 2005 - 3:25 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Oops sorry! I teach in a Private school mums have 4x4s and daddy
has an S class.
|
Simon
Dec 30th, 2005 - 3:29 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
What do you drive or would you like to be driving, Dajwid?
|
Dave
Dec 30th, 2005 - 7:48 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I confess I'm quite surprised to hear about Poles expensive
driving four wheel drive cars in Poland. I thought everybody was
driving around in those small Polish-built Fiats and old VW,
Mercedes, BMW cars from Germany scrape / junk yards
.
Even more suprising is that people have the money to drive Land
Rovers and other similar expensive 4WD cars around for fun! Things
are not as bleak in Poland as we sometimes imagine in England.
Location: York
|
Dajwid
Dec 30th, 2005 - 8:47 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I have:
Alfa romeo 155 for everday use
VW campervan for weekends
Fiat 126 I am totally rebuilding with all new parts.
What would I like to get?
1957 slit screen VW bus
A good Warsawa fast back.
Fiat 500
Old landy or Range for off roading
If you want to get me a present.
Aston DB9 Please British racing green.
What about you?
|
Klaus
Dec 30th, 2005 - 10:49 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Nice topic
. I've just bought a new Range Rover Sport:-
I haven't even driven it across the Polish border, yet. Maybe I
will on Sunday if I feel brave 
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
|
Simon
Dec 31st, 2005 - 10:16 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Land Rover Discovery
Renault Kangoo (business use)
VW Polo (reserve emergency car!). But I'm looking hard for a Landy
Defender to replace this with.
Future car:
Klaus's Range Rover - brand new, same colour (in my dreams!!)
Klaus what do you do to have such a car!?! I'm very jealous
Location: Poland
|
Simon
Dec 31st, 2005 - 10:23 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I drove the 126 when I first came to Poland. A truely terrible
car!!!!
Location: Poland
|
Dajwid
Dec 31st, 2005 - 2:29 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Fantastic car
Like a bloody go kart,great fun to drive. should never have been
made street legal. Did you know there is a 126 club in the UK?
|
Klaus
Dec 31st, 2005 - 8:41 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
How to have your own Range Rover Sport in three steps:
1- Work hard with your own company
2- Don't have children
3- Don't live in Poland and earn zloty!
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
|
Klaus
Dec 31st, 2005 - 9:02 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Are Fiat 126 the tiny, very slow cars driven by spotty teenagers
in sportswear and old men with moustaches?
Location: Frankfurt, Germany
|
Hania
Jan 1st, 2006 - 12:43 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Are Fiat 126 the tiny, very slow cars driven by spotty teenagers
in sportswear and old men with moustaches?
Answer - yes 
.
|
dajwid
Jan 1st, 2006 - 8:36 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Slow 126 slow!!! That depends on what engine you have fitted
German cars are really popular on poland. Golfs and polos old
Mercs, Opels.
Over the last year cars on the road have improved as prices for
used have dropped.
|
Cottbus Man
Jan 3rd, 2006 - 10:50 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Do you think that German cars get vandalized more than Polish cars
do in Poland? I've heard about German cars being stolen but not so
much vandalism.
Location: Cottbus
|
Marek
Jan 4th, 2006 - 2:58 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
a new car with german registration plate will be scratched by
Polish more often than car with polish plates. this is true.
i have noticed that more and more polish with money drive 4x4
cars.
i like toyota rav4
Location: Poznań
|
dajwid
Jan 4th, 2006 - 8:44 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I live in the tricity there are now 4 porsche 4x4s all driven by
women, yes there is money in Poland.
local 4x4 meets normaly have 50 plus cars, many are new cars.
|
Charles
Jan 4th, 2006 - 11:33 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I have just got a new black Nissan Pathfinder and last time I was
in Poland, I was amazed that the price was about the same as in
the UK. Was thinking of driving over next time but don't think
I'll bother as I expect British cars will get the same treatment
as the Germans?
Location: UK
|
Remus
Jan 4th, 2006 - 11:53 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Hahaha
Range Rover Sport, Chrysler Cherokee, A BMW X5, Toyota rav4 are
not real off-road vehicles. They are at the very most "semi
off-road vehicles". These are limousines for reach
middle-aged snobs who like to pretend brave young boys to impress
sexy girls.
Real off-roader is cruel primitive ugly uncomfortable bull (except
for Toyota Landcruiser which is a luxurious off-roader rather than
a limo pretending to be off-road car)
Real off-roaders are Russian UAZ or Land Rover Defender.
Location: Gdansk, Poland
|
Neil
Jan 5th, 2006 - 9:08 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I think the cheapest ferry route would be Dover - Calais and then
drive across Holland and Germany. But, best if you want a shorter
drive would probably be to go to Hamburg by ferry from the UK.
German roads are very good. I've never been to Poland, so I don't
know about them. But from what I have read here your Land Rover
will come in handy
.
Location: Cork
|
Michael
Jan 6th, 2006 - 1:41 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
"I have just got a new black Nissan Pathfinder and last time
I was in Poland, I was amazed that the price was about the same as
in the UK. Was thinking of driving over next time but don't think
I'll bother as I expect British cars will get the same treatment
as the Germans? "
I think a car with UK registration plates will be as safe as one
with Polish plates. I drive to Poland with my Dutch registered BMW
X3 and have no problems. I think only German cars are likely to
get the special treatment from certain elements of Polish society.
Location: Nijmegen
|
Len
Jan 6th, 2006 - 4:20 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Any American SUVs on Polish roads?
Location: Canada
|
monica
Jan 6th, 2006 - 4:41 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
What do people do for living to afford an SUV in Poland ? 
Location: canada
|
Dajwid
Jan 6th, 2006 - 6:27 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Most of the people I know here have companies in Poland and have
SUVs. There are a lot of rich poles here.
i must post a picture of the cars lined up outside my local
private school, new BMWs Mercs, Jeeps, porsches. all Poles!
(I park my car round the corner)
|
Remus
Jan 6th, 2006 - 7:43 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
"new BMWs Mercs, Jeeps, porsches. all Poles!"
...and all stolen in Germany
(posted on behalf of Klaus)
Location: Gdansk, Poland
|
Offroader
Jan 11th, 2006 - 9:57 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I would like to buy ex military Polish and Russian 4 4WD cars. Can
anybody offer any suggestions as to where I can buy in Poland. Do
the Polish army sell these cars off direct to the public?
Location: Inverness
|
dajwid
Jan 11th, 2006 - 10:46 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Try
Allegro.pl It is a polish auction site like ebay. It is the most
popular auction site in Poland always plenty of old Gaz and Uaz.
|
Hank
Jan 14th, 2006 - 3:22 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
In answer to an earlier question in this converssation abour 4x4
in Poland - No, American cars are not popular in Poland. The
Polish mostly drive old German cars. The rich ones new German
cars. I don't think they have much imagination. Or maybe Polish
people don't like or know much about cars.
Location: USA
|
dajwid
Jan 14th, 2006 - 1:24 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I'm sorry I disagree, go to a few of the off road meets, go to a
few tuning shows or club meets. There are clubs for most cars in
Poland from 126p up. Now used cars are much cheaper here so there
is more choice. I have and Alfa and I have found a lot of users
here, very helpfull club, the same with my VW campervan.
OK not as many Aston martins as the UK but????
|
Jeff
Jan 17th, 2006 - 8:03 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
What term is used in Poland by Poles to describe 4 wheel drive
cars like Land Rover? 4x4, 4WD, SUV, AWD, ATV ... ...
Location: Ireland
|
Simon
Jan 17th, 2006 - 11:37 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Of these: 4x4 is probably the most widely known and used. Lots of
Poles use the Polish word - terenowy (all terrain vehicle)
|
Scott Free
Feb 24th, 2006 - 4:03 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Hate to put a downer on this SUV love-in, but you guys do realise
we're in the middle of an Oil Crisis. My solution "Draft SUV
drivers first". in other words take your SUV and an assault
rifle and go fight for your own oil. Alright i'll get off my high
horse now
Location: Australia
|
Simon
Feb 24th, 2006 - 6:49 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Maybe a 4 x 4 vehicle is rather more thirsty than a standard car,
and, therefore not particularly eco-friendly. But, in Poland,
apart from the fun factor, a 4WD is very useful method of
transport for navigating fairly normal Polish roads! Many roads,
outside of places like Warsaw, are very uneven; full of potholes;
covered with gravel and mud; cobblestoned; or little more than mud
tracks. Here's a photo (taken yesterday) of one such Polish road,
which leads to a village in Lubuskie I visit often:
Location: Poland
|
Simon
Feb 24th, 2006 - 6:54 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
There are lots of good roads in Poland. And the EU are financing a
lot of road building and highway improvements. But there are still
a lot of roads in need of some improvement!
Location: Poland
|
Hans
Feb 24th, 2006 - 11:40 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
It's true - Polish roads can be a challenge
.
Location: Berlin
|
Sarah
Mar 3rd, 2006 - 9:50 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I have to say I think a 4x4 is an ideal vehicle for Poland - its
the only place I've been where I've seen a slip road running off
the motorway which was cobbled
Location: UK
|
Simon
Mar 4th, 2006 - 11:49 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
The website allegro (a copy of the ebay idea) normally have a
selection of second hand cars for sale. You might find a discovery
there.
Otherwise there are 'auto komis' places all over Poland, which
sell used cars. Where are you in Poland, Victor?
Location: Poland
|
Mark
Mar 6th, 2006 - 9:06 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Si - have you checked out the auto Komis in Desczno, on the left as you
drive to Poznań?
|
Simon
Mar 6th, 2006 - 9:45 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Yep, I noticed that they have three or four 4x4s for sale. I even
stopped off and had a look a few days back. They have an ancient
Mercedes G-Wagen; an old Range Rover; and a mid 1990s Discovery.
None of them are in great condition, but, they are all fairly
reasonably priced. I was going to suggest to Victor he check there
but aren't sure where he is. Anyway, here's a link to their
website: http://autoroch.pl/?dzial=oferta
There's also a used car place on the right hand side of the new
'express highway' towards Lubniewice. Lots of 4WDs but I don't
have their contact details. I'll drop by sometime this week if I
get time.
What are you driving now, Mark?
Do you know anything about buying a used car in Germany?
Insurance, registration, import taxes, etc. Prices are a hell of a
lot cheaper in Germany.
Location: Poland
|
Mark
Mar 6th, 2006 - 10:22 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I seem to remember seeing a few on the route to Zielona Góra, but
can't exactly place them at the mo. I'll look into it on my next
trip.
Not too au fait with the importing, although have several friends
who have done so and are very satisfied.
I'm still driving my old Lanos, but from what I've heard,
importing from the UK is the way forward. If you have a UK
address, you can register it there and drive it here no problem.
Then, if you do decide you want to register it here, you can get
it adapted (change the dash, steering rack, lights, wipers etc.).
Depending on the car, it would cost anything from 3K to over 10k
with regard to whether you can get the parts from scrapped cars or
if they have to be bought new. Personally, I'm looking at getting
a 2003 MG ZT-T. Same price in the UK as the base Rover 75 over
here.
|
Simon
Mar 6th, 2006 - 1:49 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
You're right buying a used car in the UK, especially a British
one, seems on the surface to make a lot of sense. Huge selection
of cars to choose from; far cheaper prices; and much easier
haggling / negotiation. I looked at some Land Rover Series 3 and
110 Defender's while I was there a few weeks back but in the end
gave up when the insurance thing started to seem complicated.
Using an address in England is possible for me but the absence of
a UK-based no claims discount and insurance history seemed
problematic. And as you say registering and insuring a left hand
car in Poland seems tricky and a mite expensive. I'm guessing you
couldn't insure a UK registered car with Polish insurers like PZU?
More research is needed
...
Location: Poland
|
Simon
Mar 6th, 2006 - 1:53 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
How reliable is your Lanos?
My next road car will most likely be the estate version of the
Rover 75. If I can find a good one.
Location: Poland
|
Mark
Mar 7th, 2006 - 8:46 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Generally, I've been really pleased with it. No major breakdowns
and just the usual wearables replaced.
I think you'll be lucky to find a nicely priced 75 estate in
Poland. Lack of dealers back in the day, coupled with the
bankrupcy has made them very rare indeed. Conversely, they are
quite cheap for the same reason.
|
Mark
Mar 7th, 2006 - 8:48 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
this is the only one I could find on allegro:
http://www.otomoto.pl/index.php?sect=show&id=C929419
|
Magda
Mar 7th, 2006 - 10:33 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Coincidence: My dad has a Lanos and I like Rover 75
. Here is review of the most beautiful car in world:-
http://www.motoring.co.za/index.php?fSectionId=874&fArticleId=230154
Location: Poznań
|
Mark
Mar 7th, 2006 - 10:38 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
hmm - I wonder what else we have in common.....
|
Simon
Mar 8th, 2006 - 6:44 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Here's a link to a place in the west of Poland specializing in
used 4x4 cars:
http://www.autaterenowe.pl/carview.php
Location: Poland
|
Simon
Mar 8th, 2006 - 6:50 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Once you've bought your car you might want to join the already
mentioned and rather fun:
International
4x4 Club Poland
or the more specialist:
Land Rover Club
Polska
Location: Poland
|
4wd fan
Mar 23rd, 2006 - 1:06 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Do owners of cars have to pay road tax every year on cars they own
in Poland? If so is it more expensive for large cars like 4wds?
Location: Glasgow
|
Tomek
Mar 26th, 2006 - 3:16 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
There is no road tax for cars in Poland. Tax is added to cost of
petrol, gas, and diesel.
|
Hans
May 25th, 2006 - 10:54 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I'd like the answer to the same question Norman asked here in
December. Nobody has given an answer yet!
"Are you allowed to drive cars through the forest in Poland?
When I was there last I saw lots of great dirt tracks but my
Polish guide said for non forestry cars it was forbidden to use
them. "
Location: Berlin
|
casper
May 25th, 2006 - 6:34 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Does anyone know how import duties are levied on cars imported
from Germany? We've been looking for a 4x4 in Germany because
second hand they are much much cheaper than the UK. Ideal cars is
Porsche 4x4 they rock second choice is the Infiniti (nissan).
However, living in the real world I think we will plump for either
a freelander or mabye if I can stretch the X5 both of which are
very cool.
Reason for having a 4x4 so that if I have an accident the other
fucker will end up dead not me.
|
CK
May 25th, 2006 - 6:39 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
"Reason for having a 4x4 so that if I have an accident the
other fucker will end up dead not me"
Good reason
. The roads are also perfect for 4wd's!
How about the new shape Land Rover Discovery. That one looks hot.
|
Sarah
May 25th, 2006 - 8:05 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
We have a Nissan Pathfinder (new model) which I believe is
effectively the same as the Infinity and I would certainly
recommend it. Its a big beast but drives very much like a car and
I use it for motorway driving for a lot of business travel and it
also gets used in the mud on farms shooting and riding etc at
weekends. Its got real offroad capabilities.
I suppose it depends on what you want it for but I agree that with
Polands roads, snow in winter, driving standards etc, a big 4X4 is
the way to go. We will likely sell before we leave and get a
Navara double cab Pickup over there or from Germany and will
certainly join Simons 4X4 club as it won't be too far from us.
Location: UK
|
claire
May 26th, 2006 - 9:58 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I'd like the answer to the same question Norman asked here in
December. Nobody has given an answer yet!
"Are you allowed to drive cars through the forest in Poland?
When I was there last I saw lots of great dirt tracks but my
Polish guide said for non forestry cars it was forbidden to use
them. "
No. You are not allowed.
My husband inquired within the last 12 months and that was his
answer. He was looking to take a few shortcuts into town while the
road to work was being ripped apart.
c
Location: gdansk
|
Tomek
Aug 22nd, 2006 - 8:44 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
But everyone drives through forest. It's funny 
.
|
Kazimierz Kowalski
Aug 23rd, 2006 - 4:33 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Hmm, I wonder why people aren't allowed to drive on these tracks.
Location: Sydney
|
Hans
Aug 23rd, 2006 - 11:17 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Some forest tracks have no-entry signs, others have military area
signs, most have nothing to say not to drive them. If there is no
sign I drive along them
.
There are also non-forest unsurfaced road all over the place.
Poland is a great place for offroad driving.
Location: Poland
|
Elena
Aug 23rd, 2006 - 7:35 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
errrr..ahem...but what about the dreadful fuel consumption and
carbon emissions?
4X4s
Higher fuel consumption
higher carbon emissions
worse injuries
more deaths
greater illegal behaviour by drivers like: not wearing seatbelts
and using mobiles while driving
not SUVs but FUV's
F*** U Vehicles
|
Bialonoz
Aug 23rd, 2006 - 8:22 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
They're a type of phallic extension for men who feel they are
'lacking something'.
Location: Podlasie
|
Hans
Aug 23rd, 2006 - 11:43 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
No, that's not true
.
The cars driven by those sort of men are those tacky
American-style pick up trucks.
Location: Poland
|
Dajwid
Aug 27th, 2006 - 8:21 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Higher fuel consumption
higher carbon emissions
worse injuries
more deaths
greater illegal behaviour by drivers like: not wearing seatbelts
and using mobiles while driving
not SUVs but FUV's
F*** U Vehicles
What a load of rubbish.
worse injuries:- They are safer than most tiny, tinny cars on the
road.
more deaths:- Where, why, when, how?
greater illegal behaviour by drivers like: not wearing seatbelts
and using mobiles while driving.
Where did you get this info from?
Do you actually know what a 4x4 is?
Have you ever been to an off road meet?
If you don't know what you are talking about why comment.
More deaths in Poland are caused by non 4x4s.
Every day I see people in non 4x4s driving like pratts and using
phones.
There are drivers good and bad in all sorts of cars. If I buy a
Merc I am OK the fact id can do 0-100 in 4.5 seconds is OK. If I
buy a Gaz that does 0-100 in 25 second I am a maniac who wants to
kill babies and cause chaos on the roads.
Strange that the same comments were made in th past about e type
jags and Cobras now they are OK and off road cars suffer.
Before you ask, no I do not have a 4x4. I have a Volvo estate, VW
campervan and a maluch. But will get a Hummer when I move to the
UK and then race around Brighton all day talking on the Phone.
|
Gary
Aug 27th, 2006 - 10:57 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
4X4s
"Higher fuel consumption"
Than what? My 4x4 averages over 30 miles to the gallon in town. My
friends BMW saloon does 20 if he is lucky!
"higher carbon emissions"
Same as above. Also mine has 7 seats rather than 2 in some sports
cars (those are the penis extentions) with higher emmissions. My
car gets used for shooting (before anyone gets politically correct
its mostly clays, not that I care anyway!) and riding (etc) at
weekends where two familes go in the one car rather than the two
we would need otherwise. Therefore my emissions are actually
lower.
"worse injuries"
Driving a large 4x4 saved a friend and his families lives when
they were hit by a lorry (this was confirmed in the accident
report) In a "normal" car he, his wife and two children
would have been dead now. They escaped with just scratches.
"more deaths"
See above, significantly better all round visability helps prevent
accidents.
"greater illegal behaviour by drivers like: not wearing
seatbelts and using mobiles while driving"
What a load of lefty bo**ocks, wheres the proof on this?
Such sweeping statements without any factual justification. Oh and
by the way I will be buying a 4x4 pickup when I move to Poland
(not American), nothing to do with my penis which I am told is big
enough, just practicality both domestic and business.
Location: UK/Poland
|
Elena
Aug 27th, 2006 - 11:45 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
No these are documented facts Gary. A reputable survey carried out
in the UK and reported in the Independent was more conclusive than
it expected to be about the increased illegal use of mobiles and
the non use of seatbelts by 4x4 users.
The people in the 4x4s are safer but no-one-else is. If more
people are travelling at one go then of course fuel consumption
and associated carbon emissions but just like most cars they are
often used by one person alone.
Of course the hi spec cars you mention are almost as bad as 4x4s
but these statistics are based on the more average size cars.
In the light of current environmental crisis driving at all is
highly questionable and is at the expense of others. Driving 4x4s
is an obscenity. Of course 4x4s get better visibility, that's
because EVERYBODY-ELSE loses theirs!
Of course the occupants of 4x4s are safer but when you compare
equivalent accidents where 4x4s are involved with those with
average vehicles. Accidents at similar speeds involve injury in
'average' cars but death in 4x4s. This is a basic fact of physics
because a 4x4s are of course heavier (and that is why they consume
more fuel and create higher carbon emissions) and therefore at the
same speed they have greater momentum at the point of impact.
Gary you are probably a careful driver but the point is that
accidents are accidents, they happen. Is your driving perfect,
have you never had a loss of concentration? Any accident involving
a 4x4 (or vehicle of equivalent weight) WILL generate
proportionately MORE death or injury. This is a fact of physics
and one you amply demonstrate by your accident report. Of course
if we all consumed less, there would be fewer lorries on the road.
It's not that I'm not happy your 4x4 saved your lives but in the
overall balance they are killing more than they save. Try talking
to the guys in Greenland who can no longer carry out their
centuries old livlihood because the ice is too thin or to the
people in the islands which WILL diappear. This isn't about
political correctness, this is about basic humanity and
responsibility for our actions.
I'm sorry the facts are not welcome but they are the facts. How
about considering a less damaging vehicle? You'll feel better! And
for goodness sake don't wreck Poland, the one legacy of Communism
and the dreadful economic impact is that it has a wonderful
natural heritage which is largely although not totally spoiled.
Haven't human beings ruined enough?
And since my fairly low emission car got smashed up in a stupid
accident, I have been amazed by how wonderful it is not to have a
car. My stress levels have dropped enormously, no worrying about
pollution, money for petrol, for repairs, no worrying about
parking, or speeding tickets or near misses. I can wholeheartedly
recommend it.
|
Hans
Aug 27th, 2006 - 11:56 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
If you live in a city and never leave the area then you can
probably do without a car. And yes people not owning cars is
better for the environment. But for me I love the freedom a car
brings. I also feel much safer as a driver in a large 4x4. Besides
this I enjoy driving down tracks and unpathed roads, so I think
I'll be keeping my 4x4.
Location: Poland
|
Elena
Aug 27th, 2006 - 2:27 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
that of course is a matter for your conscience. I hire cars on an
occasional basis and I LOVE the freedom of not worrying about it
all even without the ethical element of things.
|
Hans
Aug 27th, 2006 - 2:52 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I also feel that the Chinese, Americans, and increasingly Indians,
pollute the planet without regard to anyone else, so my driving
around Germany and Poland in a new 4x4 doesn't make a whole lot of
difference.
Location: Poland
|
Hans
Aug 27th, 2006 - 3:00 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I added the 'new' in front of 4x4 not because I wanted to brag,
but to illustrate the difference between the pollution a new car
makes and an old one
.
Location: Poland
|
Elena
Aug 27th, 2006 - 3:24 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
...and of course that's the view taken by all the individual
americans, chinese and indians...and if we all take that view we
are truly...ge-f***ed.
Even if it is too late, I am happier not contributing to it...but
do drive carefully, not for yourself (although for that too) but
in consideration of the greater impact of any driving arrors.
As the Quakers say "Wear it as long as you can!"
Swords in 16th Century, cars and certainly FUVs in the 21st.
|
slepowron
Aug 27th, 2006 - 7:30 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
“I also feel that the Chinese, Americans, and increasingly
Indians, pollute the planet without regard to anyone else”
I can’t speak for the Chinese (and neither can they) nor the
Indians but this “Americans polluting the world” is growing
tiresome. The US mandated unleaded cars in 1975 and it was
virtually impossible to find a station selling leaded fuel by
1985. By 1990 only 1% of US fuel sales were leaded compared to a
57% global average. (An average brought down by the low US
numbers) The EU only prohibited leaded fuel sales in January of
2000 (with exemptions)
US Rivers are much less polluted that European rivers, I’d much
rather take my chances swimming in Washington’s Potomac or
Boston’s Charles than Paris’ Seine or Berlin’s Spree
The US established its cabinet ministry for environment in 1970
and Canada followed a year and a half later. Germany’s
environmental ministry (1986) just celebrated its twentieth
anniversary. In France and Britain the start of environmental
ministries is more difficult to date as the title and portfolio
was bounced and matched with other ministries for decades.
The US has much more to do with regards to the environment and has
much to learn from others. However, the stereotype of the
polluting American is more prejudice than fact.
|
Hans
Aug 27th, 2006 - 7:41 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Here I was referring to pollution in the US caused by cars. US
cars are incredibly gas thirsty and there are a lot of them.
Location: Poland
|
Dajwid
Aug 28th, 2006 - 7:48 AM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
Oh come on! Enjoy yourselves! Nothing beats blasting around the
forest in an old landy.
Worse things are happening in the world.
Get you Landy sport out and blast through Polands forests. There
are fantastic tracks in most forests.
I had a VW Syncro 4x4VW Van. Fantastic fun.
recently I used a friends Quad, had a great few days in Kaszuby.
Good tracks, great mud and hills. Hardly saw a single person.
Churning up a bit of mud just lets the mushrooms grow better the
next year.
and keeps the ants busy.
|
Cezarek
Aug 28th, 2006 - 12:01 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
They're great fun, but it's worth remebering that bull bars (those
tacky looking things they put on the front of 4x4s) are the
difference between an injured pedestrian and a dead one.
|
Hans
Aug 28th, 2006 - 11:11 PM |
Re: 4x4 / 4WD / SUV / OFFROAD
POLAND
I plan to join the 4x4 club mentioned here, so if any forum
members are also members we'll be meeting sometime soon
.
Location: Poland
|
Hans
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